So what system is going to the best? Would the XBox or Gamecube be worth the wait over just getting ps2 now? How will the graphics compare with eachohter? Which systems will have better games? Thanks..

by looking at the specs of those consoles I'd rather have a pc.. 'cause the games for the consoles will garenteed to have a emulator on computer of some sort

You are asking the wrong questions bud... most people here (including me) will take a good PC over a console any day

Well if you are in college, you will see the advantages of haveing a console system.

Duo

Personally, I think the Xbox will be the superior console. Whether or not it will surpass Sony in terms of sales will remain to be seen. The Xbox is more powerful than than the PS2 and is much easier to develop for. I know what you're saying, technical specs aren't what's important, it's the games, right? In that case, Xbox is going in the right direction. Not only do they have nearly every big Japanese console developer, they have a number of US developers and PC developers supporting it not to mention Microsoft's own gaming division. The Xbox will also support HDTV, and broadband contectivity. Currently, I am one of the fortunate people to own a PS2 but I'm really not all that impressed yet. The Dreamcast was much more impressive on launch than the PS2 is. I do think that the battle between PS2 and Xbox will ultimately kill the Gamecube, however.

quote:Originally posted by Duo:
Well if you are in college, you will see the advantages of haveing a console system.

Duo

Also, I find myself looking more to consoles for certain types of games, like fighting and sports. I'll never abandon my PC as a gaming platform, but there are definite reasons for having a console as well. After not even considering consoles for a few years, I'm impressed by the graphics and capabilities they have today. I like playing games, no matter what platform they happen to be on. As far as the PS2/X-Box/GameCube stuff, I'll just wait a while for the prices to come down, then see which system is on top.

I've heard the PS2 isn't as programmer friendly as it was supposed to be. That's what killed Sega Saturn. Best graphics for it's day, but it was a bitch to code for so no one made games for it. Time will tell.
I think Xbox has the best chance of cleaning house 'cause Microsoft has a lot of weight, and money, to throw around.
But right now I think the Dreamcast is sittin' pretty. Sega.net is up, so on-line gaming is there for the games that support it. The DC has a lot of good games out. The modem is modular so when broadband becomes the standard Sega can release a broadband modem to replace the 56k modem. It's cheap as hell now, and the PS2 is having supply problems like no hell in the US. I don't think the DC will be the "console king" but I think it'll keep Sega alive in the console war.
It's interesting that many people, including me, thought that the Dreamcast came out to "late" to compete w/the N64 and PS1, and too early to compete with other next gen consoles. We all thought the PS2 would beat it into the ground. But now w/the PS2 supply problem, and the Xbox and gamecube on the horizon, the Dreamcast is getting a better foot hold. I think the PS2, Xbox, and Gamecube are going to eat into each others sales so no one company will dominate like Sony did with the PS1.

Hmmm... sorry, this post got away from me and turned into a bit of a rant.

Lethal

I would be kinda hard to emulate the gamecube because nintendo say they will use non-standard 1.5GB 8cm discs for their games.

I don't think that would matter very much... You just need the hdd space to cope with it that's all...

This is prolly gonna get some interesting responses, but isnt that the point?! Anyway, here goes:

Sony made a big mistake with the launch of their PS2 console. The PS2 console itself is not the mistake -- the hardware is by far very powerful and capable. The mistake Sony made was in the SDK libraries. When Sony released the PSX (way back when) they gave game developers a HUGE library to use when developing games. This is why the PSX has such a strong game audience -- no wait, thats not the right word -- game base. For some reason i cant figure out, Sony didnt give developers SQUAT for the PS2 launch. So, as it turns out, theres a whole lot of pi**ed off game developers right now, cuz its a pain in the ass for them to develop games for the PS2 without libraries to help them... its damn hard to write code for specific hardware if u dont have any libraries for that hardware... any game developer, PC or console, will agree to that. So, for a long time to come, the PS2 will not have the greatest games, even tho their hardware is capable of so much more. This explains the lackluster response that most PS2 games are getting right now. The biggest consequence of this mistake is not the disappointment of the fans, but the fact that this setback will give both the X-Box and the Gamecube time to come to market and take a piece of the pie. Its obvious that Microsoft has gathered quite a mass of game developers, and Nintendo also has many game developers who are loyal, plus Nintendo always has tons of games for their systems. This is by far the reason Im playing on my DC and not a PS2 -- aside from the fact that theyre kinda hard to come by... but i have friends that work at Best Buy, so i could have gotten one last week when the shipment came in. But again, no system is worth anything if there are no good games to use it with.

Now, to comment on what Bataar was talking abt. I agree with the fact that the X-Box has some great system specs, but I think its a mistake to go with an Intel P3 for the CPU of the console. Taking into account that games require a strong FPU, it would seem smarter for Microsoft to go with an AMD Athlon for the CPU. Of course, then again, i dont understand the reasoning behind using a CISC processor instead of a RISC processor like all other consoles. I know Microsoft wants to be different, but CISC processors like those found in all our computers arent designed to be used the way a console will use the processor, and thats the reason that consoles always use RISC processors. Theyre designed to do the kind of work that console systems demand. Its my opinion that the X-Box, while perhaps superior in pure hardware specs, will suffer in performance where a same-speed RISC processor would rule the console land.

quote: Originally posted by Toonzville:
Sony made a big mistake with the launch of their PS2 console. The PS2 console itself is not the mistake -- the hardware is by far very powerful and capable. The mistake Sony made was in the SDK libraries. When Sony released the PSX (way back when) they gave game developers a HUGE library to use when developing games. This is why the PSX has such a strong game audience -- no wait, thats not the right word -- game base. For some reason i cant figure out, Sony didnt give developers SQUAT for the PS2 launch. So, as it turns out, theres a whole lot of pi**ed off game developers right now, cuz its a pain in the ass for them to develop games for the PS2 without libraries to help them... its damn hard to write code for specific hardware if u dont have any libraries for that hardware... any game developer, PC or console, will agree to that. So, for a long time to come, the PS2 will not have the greatest games, even tho their hardware is capable of so much more. This explains the lackluster response that most PS2 games are getting right now. The biggest consequence of this mistake is not the disappointment of the fans, but the fact that this setback will give both the X-Box and the Gamecube time to come to market and take a piece of the pie. Its obvious that Microsoft has gathered quite a mass of game developers, and Nintendo also has many game developers who are loyal, plus Nintendo always has tons of games for their systems. This is by far the reason Im playing on my DC and not a PS2 -- aside from the fact that theyre kinda hard to come by... but i have friends that work at Best Buy, so i could have gotten one last week when the shipment came in. But again, no system is worth anything if there are no good games to use it with.

PREACH IT BABY! Absolutely dead on. In fact, even though the PS2 is more powerful than the DC, the people programming ResEvil: Code V for PS2 say they are having trouble making it looks as good as it does on the DC. DC = Microsoft OS + Libraries = Happy Coders.
quote:Now, to comment on what Bataar was talking abt. I agree with the fact that the X-Box has some great system specs, but I think its a mistake to go with an Intel P3 for the CPU of the console. Taking into account that games require a strong FPU, it would seem smarter for Microsoft to go with an AMD Athlon for the CPU. Of course, then again, i dont understand the reasoning behind using a CISC processor instead of a RISC processor like all other consoles. I know Microsoft wants to be different, but CISC processors like those found in all our computers arent designed to be used the way a console will use the processor, and thats the reason that consoles always use RISC processors. Theyre designed to do the kind of work that console systems demand. Its my opinion that the X-Box, while perhaps superior in pure hardware specs, will suffer in performance where a same-speed RISC processor would rule the console land.

You spew the truth from every oriface, toonzville. the 400 Mhz Gamecube processor is going to be right on par with the 700 Mhz intel Processor because that processor is made for gaming only. The specs mean nothing.

However, you have to consider which will be easier to develop for. The Gamecube's processor could very well experience problems similar to the PS2 if no one knows how to develop properly for it. With the Xbox utilizing DirectX, it will be by far, the easiest console to develop for. Which means it will be easier for developers to make full use of the power of the system.

Nintendo has repeatedly announced that they are making huge libraries SPECIFICALLY to help game developers with the GameCube.

They know that the reason the N64 had so few games (and so few good games) was that it was hard to develop for, because it was a very rushed, last minute backup plan for the joint Sony-Nintendo venture that Sony backed out of. (in order to market its own Playstation)

So I think GameCube will be as developer friendly as the Xbox, and coupled with its superior technical specs, it will probably be a much better system.

quote:Originally posted by Bataar:
However, you have to consider which will be easier to develop for. The Gamecube's processor could very well experience problems similar to the PS2 if no one knows how to develop properly for it. With the Xbox utilizing DirectX, it will be by far, the easiest console to develop for. Which means it will be easier for developers to make full use of the power of the system.

i didnt say, or at least didnt mean to say, that the X-Box wouldnt be the easiest system to write games for... of course DX is gonna make writing games easier, but is DX capable of all the things that console systems can do? if so, then PC games would be just as rich and smooth and life-like as DC games... but theyre not... we all know that PC graphics hardware is very capable, but drivers arent, and neither is DX.

Currently, my GeForce 2 does better graphics than any console I have seen, and yes, I own a Dreamcast and a PS2. With Nvidia custom developing the graphics chip and the new X chip for Xbox, it will be the most power graphics chip short a SGI workstation.

Also, you have to take into consideration that PC games are developed for the lowest common denominator. Many of us have high end PCs but most PC games require only a minimum of a 233 or 300mhz system. With the Xbox, developers will be able to develop games with a minimum of a 733mhz processor and Nvidia's custom graphics chip.

quote:Originally posted by Bataar:
Also, you have to take into consideration that PC games are developed for the lowest common denominator. Many of us have high end PCs but most PC games require only a minimum of a 233 or 300mhz system. With the Xbox, developers will be able to develop games with a minimum of a 733mhz processor and Nvidia's custom graphics chip.

I see what you're saying Bataar, but I have to disagree a bit. Yes, PC games have to be made for a very broad audience(233mhz-1ghz plus systems), but the PC games are scalable. Q3 on a P2-350 w/a 32meg video card will look a lot worse than Q3 on a 1ghz plus system w/a GF2 Ultra. New games are made to push system requirements with all the eye candy turned on.
Secondly, by the time the X-box comes out a 733mhz chip is probably gonna be on the low in the computer world.

Anyway... Is it just me, or is this a really cool time for the gaming industry? All this new technology starting to blur the line between computers and consoles.
It seems to me that the main reason people love their computers is they are upgradable, internet play, and you can download mods and such for games. So, what if someone wrote a very basic OS that was made just for gaming? So, instead of having running Win9x, Win2k,etc you'd run a gaming only OS w/a broswer so you could get around on line.
Of course we all use our comps for more than gaming, but it is gaming that keeps us upgrading all the time so the other comp could some 300mhz machine that you used for word proccessing, internet, etc. Wouldn't that be the best of both worlds? An upgradable machine running an OS optimized for gaming? Just a thought.

Lethal

quote:Originally posted by Bataar:
Personally, I think the Xbox will be the superior console. Whether or not it will surpass Sony in terms of sales will remain to be seen. The Xbox is more powerful than than the PS2 and is much easier to develop for. I know what you're saying, technical specs aren't what's important, it's the games, right? In that case, Xbox is going in the right direction. Not only do they have nearly every big Japanese console developer, they have a number of US developers and PC developers supporting it not to mention Microsoft's own gaming division. The Xbox will also support HDTV, and broadband contectivity...

I agree, the X-Box deffinately looks like the superior system. Im a PC gamer all the way, but there ARE certain advantages to consoles. For one, a console is easier to transport, like taking to sombodies house. Its cool to hang out and play games a little at a party or somthing like that where everybody is just hanging out, you can come in, set it up and have people playing in no time.
As was mentioned before, certain games are better on consoles (fighting games are my fave console type game).

Another nice feature is DVD capabilities. My family doesnt yet own a DVD player for our TV, so getting an X-Box would be a good solution, its about the same price as a DVD player but with all the added features.

There is no substitute for PC gaming thats for sure. But for casual hanging out, DVD watching or playing games with somone who is not really a hard core gamer, the console is definately useful.

I think the Gamecube will have the best graphics over PS2 and XBox. However, that is just my opinion. Both the XBox and Gamecube will be better than the PS2...and I think the console games will look a bit better than computer games...but as you all said, computers are more flexible. I think I'll be getting a gamecube when that comes out For now..time to play some PC games or hop in my N64!

Dudes, look at: (more on this below)
http://www2.discreet.com/games/

This is 3DMax's attempt to bring high quality no BS content to the PC!!!

This is significant - because proffesional games - console, PC, even movies, begin with 3DMax to develop the content.

I bet gMax puts DirectX "game" library to extreme punishment and shame. Most kids these days don't talk about gaming on PCs. They talk about gaming on consoles. That was even true when I was a kid - excepting DOOM and Sim City.

Nintendo's own developer's say their NOT worried about the console's power. Their up&coming has TOO much power. Its all about CONTENT. We know Nintendo will outdo themselve's as they allways have.

Maketshare: Playstation has MOST of the market. Everyone else is sharing the peice of pie that's left. I hate that 'cause the Nintendo 64 MUCH better. Doesn't matter. What people pull off the shelf is what matters. Sony had allot of titles. Sony had the better displays. Sony got the register traffic. Sony's smart.

Dudes, look at: http://www2.discreet.com/games/
Will be released SOON!!!
They have some awesome looking games for it already.
3DMax is THE content creation platform (movies, games, everything).

gMax is going to be an end-user program running all games developed in 3DMax. Most good game already are. gMax is going take it a step further.

It'll allow 3D games you can "edit" - with the best game content available. Developer's will spend time making games intertaining instead off fooling with $Gate's bull.

Definitely something to watch!

I take it back.

Content is everything. Until $Gates throws his money around. Then market dominance is everything and content takes a back seat.

I'm looking forward to the XBox because their will probably be no choice! Ever hear of "gaming on the Macintosh"? Gaming in OS2? Sega making a come-back?

Oh well. They'll be some good games on it anyway

quote:Originally posted by Bataar:
Personally, I think the Xbox will be the superior console. Whether or not it will surpass Sony in terms of sales will remain to be seen. The Xbox is more powerful than than the PS2 and is much easier to develop for. I know what you're saying, technical specs aren't what's important, it's the games, right? In that case, Xbox is going in the right direction. Not only do they have nearly every big Japanese console developer, they have a number of US developers and PC developers supporting it not to mention Microsoft's own gaming division. The Xbox will also support HDTV, and broadband contectivity. Currently, I am one of the fortunate people to own a PS2 but I'm really not all that impressed yet. The Dreamcast was much more impressive on launch than the PS2 is. I do think that the battle between PS2 and Xbox will ultimately kill the Gamecube, however.

I wished the Gamecube would die! I hate Nintendo's kiddie policies. But Mario, Donkey Kong and Poke'mon(and lame ass 007) are just too powerful. The technology used by the Gamecube is incredible and they will sell ALOT of gay Pokemon games. Oh well.

quote:Originally posted by Rick_James9:
I wished the Gamecube would die! I hate Nintendo's kiddie policies. But Mario, Donkey Kong and Poke'mon(and lame ass 007) are just too powerful. The technology used by the Gamecube is incredible and they will sell ALOT of gay Pokemon games. Oh well.

So you want a company to die because they market their games for younger people? I personally think Miyamoto is one of the best game designers around. Nintendo is gearing the Cube as a GAME CONSOLE ONLY! Not a DVD player, or a substitute for the pc. If you don't like a game console, then dont buy it. Also, all this competition drives inovation and lower prices.

quote:Originally posted by Sol:
So you want a company to die because they market their games for younger people? I personally think Miyamoto is one of the best game designers around. Nintendo is gearing the Cube as a GAME CONSOLE ONLY! Not a DVD player, or a substitute for the pc. If you don't like a game console, then dont buy it. Also, all this competition drives inovation and lower prices.

Sol take your sunglasses off bud. And read my post again. I never said I didn't like consoles. AND it think I said their technology was very good. If you like Pokemon it's fine with me but dont' get upset because I give MY opinion about Nintendo's kiddie/gay games. Now go catch 'em all!

quote:Originally posted by Rick_James9:
I wished the Gamecube would die! I hate Nintendo's kiddie policies.

That is what im talking about. Not upset about it at all. I respect your opinion, but I was giving mine back. I dont believe I said anything about you saying you didnt like consoles. It was just a post in general, that the pc and console are two different things. Some companies are gearing their consoles towards kids/games only and some are trying to market theirs as a replacement to the PC. chill...

Actually Rick, Nintendo is dropping their Kiddy Gaming Policy. The lackluster sales of the N64 and it's software made them realize that if they don't , they will lose even more money with the Gamecube.